The Truth is Very Powerful
BY: MADHUDVISA DASA
Jul 14, 2011 — AUSTRALIA (SUN) — Response to an inquiry from Yasodanandana dasa.
On Mon, Jul 11, 2011 Yasodanandana dasa wrote:
1) Where is the recorded conversation with Srila Prabhupada where they [Srila Prabhupada and Tamal] discussed the drafting and signing of the July 9th 1977? Where is it?
2) Where is the recorded conversation with Srila Prabhupada and Tamal where they discussed the inclusion of Bhavananda in the list of the original 11? One conversation on July 7 1977- nine names mentioned. One letter on July 11, 1977, 11 names mentioned.
There is recorded evidence on July 18, that Srila Prabhupada himself had requested Hamsaduta to be included in the list of the original 11.
We do know that Srila Prabhupada did sign the July 9th letter, but where is the recorded conversation which must have taken place with Srila Prabhupada to include Bhavananda in the list of the original 11.
Has anyone ever seen this? If it is available, where is it? If it is not available, why not?
ys ynd
Hare Krishna Yasodanandana Prabhu
Please accept my humble obeisances. All glories to Srila Prabhupada!
We have released all these conversations recently:
http://krishnastore.com/srila-prabhupadas-final-words-lost-conversations-from-1977-h-krishna-1709.html.
Devotees can get the DVD and listen to them all... If they want to spend the time.
There is so much evidence Prabhu and I don't see anyone presenting it very systematically.
There is the July conversation where Tamal and Prabhuapda and the other devotees talk about the July 9th letter and Prabhupada basically dictates it and Tamal just types it up. So to say that Prabhupada never read it or didn't know what was in it is such nonsense Prabhu.
These guys are mad after power and being the guru and they are blinded by this. More than blinded. They generally know what is the truth but they make up lies to try and cover the real truth. That Prabhuapda did not appoint successor acharyas, but he appointed "Rivivk representatives of the Acharya."
Also the ritvik side is not free from this cheating. Krishna Kant had to come to the point of saying that Srila Prabhupada lied to his disciples when he was saying that they should become qualified guru, they should do what he is doing, they should accept disciples, etc.
So really what we have is two groups of people here and both have their own philosophy and are only open to the comments of Srila Prabhupada that support their own philosophy.
So it is a big problem. Neither side is really correct. Prabhupada is correct and we simply have to surrender to him and hear from him and understand all the points in their full detail from him. If we have our own idea and are only open to Prabhupada's words when they support our idea that is wrong.
Anyhow as far as the July 9th letter is concerned there is so much proof.
There is the recording of Srila Prabhupada drafting it, there is the transcript of this in the folio, there is an instruction from Srila Prabhupada to Ramesvara that he should immediately duplicate the July 9th letter and his final will and put them together and mail them to all the ISKCON centers and GBC members. This was done by Ramesvara and he wrote a covering letter which he sent to all temples and GBC members stating that the attached letter describes how initiations will be carried out in ISKCON in the future...
There is no other letter from Srila Prabhupada that I am aware of that he ever ordered that it be sent to every temple and every GBC member. So that means that Srila Prabhupada considered this July 9th letter to be very, very, very important. And the fact that he ordered that Ramesvara staple it together with his final will is very strong proof that Srila Prabhupada intended that the instructions in the July 9th letter were to continue after his departure. Clearly Prabhupada's final will would be for after his disappearance from our mundane vision, and Prabhupada had Ramesvara attach the July 9th letter to this. So the two things are intimately related, the July 9th letter and Prabhupada's final will. They both describe how thing should go on in ISKCON after Srila Prabhupada's disappearance.
This is confirmed by at least 3 letters Srila Prabhupada had TKG send. Two to Hansadutta and one to Kirtananda. And there may be more letters also, these are the only ones we know about.
These documents were nicely presented many years ago by Hansadutta in his black book "Srila Prabhuapda His Movement and You." This covering letter by Ramesvara that he sent to all temples and GBC members with the July 9th letter and Prabhupada's final will and the thee letters I have mentioned about are also there.
There is no doubt in this, there is no questioning this at all. It is a fact. Srila Prabhupada established a ritvik system which was already operating in ISKCON in his physical presence and the July 9th letter was simply the continuation of this already existing process and it gave the ritvik priests the full power to accept disciples on Srila Prabhupada's behalf without the necessity of Srila Prabhupada's physical presence...
This "ritvik" preaching has been damaged a lot by fanatical devotees who, instead of simply establishing that Prabhupada established a system to accept disciples via ritvik priests and intended that same system to continue after his apparent disappearance they spend all their time and energy trying to establish that Prabhupada did not intend any of his disciples to go on to become qualified diksa gurus. Which is a lie. Actually Prabhupada's very strong desire, his mission, is to create at least one and hopefully many pure devotees who can do what he has done, become acharya, initiate disciples, preach Krishna consciousness all over the world. If someone can actually do that that would be the most pleasing thing to Srila Prabhupada.
So everything is spoiled because many of the ritviks are trying to use Prabhupada's July 9th letter to "prove" that Prabhupada did not want any of his disciples to become qualified gurus, and the other side, ISKCON, the gurus, are trying to prove that Prabhupada can not continue to accept disciples after his physical disappearance.
Both sides are trying to establish a lie...
Srila Prabhupada is living with us now in a very powerful, potent and dynamic way. In fact now we have so many more intimate and direct opportunities to associate with Srila Prabhupada personally than the devotees did in his physical presence. We have all of Srila Prabhupada's books, all of his letters, all of his conversations, his morning walks, everything we have it.
And what is the important thing about s associating with the spiritual master? It is hearing from him. This is sruti, hearing. This is the important thing. And Srila Prabhupada's transcendental words are all recorded and we can hear them as much as we want to. And the more we hear from Srila Prabhupada the more our hearts will become purified and the more Krishna conscious we will become. This is direct personal association...
So my humble request is that if we can all come together on the simple point of establishing the fact that Srila Prabhupada established a ritvik system in his physical presence and as the years went on he gave his ritvik priests more responsibility. First it was just performing the fire yajna--Srila Prabhupada would chant on the devotees beads and send them and the ritvik priest would perform the fire yajna. Then after some time it became difficult for sending all these sets of beads all over the world so Prabhupada empowered his ritvik priests to chant on the beads on his behalf, but still the temple president had to send his recommendation letter to Srila Prabhupada and Prabhupada would give the name of the disciple and write a letter back accepting that disciple. In the July 9th letter Prabhupada simply extended the already existing ritvik initiation system that had been going on for many years already in ISKCON. In the July 9th letter he empowered his ritvik priests to also give the name and also accept the disciples on Prabhupada's behalf.
These extensions to the already existing ritvik system in ISKCON by Srila Prabhupada were obviously in preparation for the time when he would be no longer physically present with us.
This is all very clear and it is a fact.
Desperate men who disagree with what Srila Prabhupada has done try so hard to cover up this fact so I am sure that if we simply honestly present this fact then the general devotee community will accept this. If we simply present this there is nothing anyone can say to defeat us or criticize us.
But if we continue to mix the truth, "Prabhupada established a ritvik initiation system to enable him to continue to accept disciples even after his physical disappearance," with lies "Prabhupada did not intend any of his disciples to go on to become qualified diksa gurus, Prabhupada did not want any more gurus for the next 10,000 years, etc", then we will continue to have no real success.
The truth is powerful. If we stick to the truth it will have a very powerful effect.
Prabhus please forgive my offenses and chant Hare Krishna and be happy!
Your servant
Madhudvisa dasa
SEE ALL ARTICLES IN THIS SERIES
A Word and a Staple, Part One
A Word and a Staple, Part Two
A Word and a Staple, Part Three
A Word and a Staple, Part Four
A Word and a Staple, Part Five
A Word and a Staple, Part Six
The Truth is Very Powerful
Evidence and Clarification
Ritvik Lies and ISKCON Lies
