Krishna-lila is Here and Now
BY: DEENANATH DASA
Jan 4, AUSTRALIA (SUN) — A response to "You Forced Krishna to Allow You to Come".
The one fundamental flaw in the presentation by Kailasha candra prabhu is that while there are ample quotations from Srila Prabhupada’s purports and conversations, there are no sastric verses that support his conclusion. Guru, sadhu and sastra are required to support any argument, with sastra being the centre. As such, from the perspective of standards of Vedic debate the article doesn’t bear much weight, and as a byproduct has made a simple issue complicated.
Below are 7 verses from the Bhagavada-gita supporting the conclusion that the jiva does not leave the spiritual world.
8.15
After attaining Me, the great souls, who are yogis in devotion, never return to this temporary world, which is full of miseries, because they have attained the highest perfection.
8.16
From the highest planet in the material world down to the lowest, all are places of misery wherein repeated birth and death take place. But one who attains to My abode, O son of Kunti, never takes birth again.
8.21
That which the Vedantists describe as unmanifest and infallible, that which is known as the supreme destination, that place from which, having attained it, one never returns-that is My supreme abode.
8.26
According to Vedic opinion, there are two ways of passing from this world-one in light and one in darkness. When one passes in light, he does not come back; but when one passes in darkness, he returns.
14.1
By becoming fixed in this knowledge, one can attain to the transcendental nature like My own. Thus established, one is not born at the time of creation or disturbed at the time of dissolution.
15.4
Thereafter, one must seek that place from which, having gone, one never returns, and there surrender to that Supreme Personality of Godhead from whom everything began and from whom everything has extended since time immemorial.
15.6
That supreme abode of Mine is not illumined by the sun or moon, nor by fire or electricity. Those who reach it never return to this material world.
Someone may argue: "These verses only say once you get to the spiritual world you never leave. They don’t say that we never leave." The implication of this argument is that Vaikuntha is full of two types of souls: those who have never fallen but can still fall, and those who have fallen once and can no longer fall again. This is equivalent to saying, "Those who have been released from jail can never again return to jail," which as we know is not true. The Bhagavad-gita makes very clear the status of the souls in the spiritual world:
15.16
There are two classes of beings, the fallible and the infallible. In the material world every living entity is fallible, and in the spiritual world every living entity is called infallible.
There are a further eleven verses in the Bhagavad-gita verses showing how Krsna protects his devotees from being lost. The above sastric references support the position that no one can fall from Vaikuntha. Now I present the words of guru and sadhu to support the same:
Srila Prabhupada:
“From Vedic scriptures it is understood that sometimes even Brahma and
Indra fall down, but a devotee in the transcendental abode of the Lord
never falls.” (Srimad-Bhagavatam 3.15.48, purport)
“
The conclusion is that no one falls from the spiritual world, or
Vaikuntha planet, for it is the eternal abode.” (Srimad-Bhagavatam 3.16.26, purport)
“This ordinary living being is of two kinds--nitya-baddha or
nitya-mukta. One is eternally conditioned and the other eternally
liberated. The eternally liberated living beings, are in the Vaikuntha
jagat, the spiritual world, and they never fall into the material
world.” (Srimad-Bhagavatam 5.11.12, purport)
Srila Baladeva Vidyabhusana:
"One cannot even imagine that the Supreme Lord Hari would ever desire that the liberated souls fall down, nor would the liberated souls ever desire to leave the Lord." (Govinda-bhasya)
Srila Vrndavana dasa Thakura:
“Therefore there is no birth or death for the Vaisnavas. They descend to the material world with the Lord and return to His abode with Him. The Vaisnava is never bound by karma and thus does not take birth in the material world.” (Caitanya-Bhagavata Antya-lila 10.172)
Srila Jiva Goswami:
“Vaikuntha is glorified for the nature that those who have attained it, have the nature not to fall down,…” (Bhagavat Sandharba 61)
Bhaktivinode Thakur explains in Chapter 16 of his Jaiva-dharma that souls are required to populate the material world in order fulfill Krishna’s desire for pastimes of saving conditioned souls. Consider the example of Arjuna. Although Arjuna was as dear to Krishna as life itself, Krishna still put Arjuna into bewilderment and suffering in order to fulfill His lila of instructing and saving conditioned souls. This is proper and no fault can accrue to the Lord for this.
One may ask ‘How could Krishna be so mean as to put souls into suffering for the sake of His pastimes?” Bhaktivinode Thakur answers this point saying that the suffering is purifying and is Krishna’s kindness: “Gold is purified by heating and hammering. Being indifferent to Krsna, the jiva has become impure through engaging in mundane sense gratification. Therefore, he must be purified by being beaten with the hammers of misery on the anvil of this material world. By this process, the misery of the jivas averse to Krsna finally culminates in happiness. Suffering is therefore just a sign of Bhagavan’s mercy. That is why far sighted people see the suffering of jivas in Krsna's pastimes as auspicious, though the near sighted can only see it as an inauspicious source of misery.” (pg 380, Ch. 16 Jaiva-dharma) This is corroborated by Srila Prabhupada: “Just like you said that you had been experiencing so many difficulties, but that is Krishna's mercy upon you to make you turn to Him more and more.” (Letter, 10 July 1971)
It is a documented fact that Prabhupada made apparently contradictory statements regarding the origin of the jiva. Why he did so, only he knows. In such cases, it is not only prudent but essential to refer back to the statements of previous acaryas to resolve the issue. In terms of this issue, no other acaryas I am aware of have indicated that the origin of the jiva was in Krishna lila, other than those jivas who have been specifically deputed by Krishna for a specific purpose, as in the example of Jaya and Vijaya.
Kailasa Candra prabhu’s article documents that fact that there are no sastric verses to support the fall from Vaikuntha argument. Based on the sastric evidence and collated statements of various acaryas, one can conclude that his presentation is unbalanced and not a correct representation of the philosophy.
Your servant,
Deenanath dasa
